Charter School Stoopid


By champlain, Section Diaries
Posted on Wed Mar 21, 2007 at 08:15:49 PM EST

Albany has been inundated with charter schools, most of which are run or conceived by wealthy white men from places like Clifton Park, Loudonville and New York City. Charter schools use taxpayer dollars but fail to give actual taxpayers a say in how the dollars are spent at these charter schools. Charter schools are privately run - but they are funded with public taxpayer dollars.

Albany residents voted on charter schools in May 2005 when they were asked if they support paying for charter schools out of the public school budget. By a vote of 4519 to 996, Albany voters said NO to the charter school tax grab.  Too bad it was a non-binding vote.  One of the charter school blowhards was quoted at the time as saying the vote was a propaganda gimmick.  A public vote is not a gimmick, its called democracy.

The white rich male suburbanites who push charter schools say they are providing a 'choice' - that may be so, but they are doing it with precious Albany taxpayer dollars. These rich white suburbanites are creating a separate school system in a city that has long had a troubled tax base because Albany is awash with not-for-profit insitutions and NYS facilities who pay no property taxes. And what do Albany residents get? Higher property taxes, bigger school taxes, higher water rates, less services.  Albany residents pay more and more while a bunch of rich white suburban men use Albany taxpayer dollars to push some twisted vision of education 'reform' and go around and spout George W. Bush-isms like 'the soft bigotry of low expectations.' The charter school tax grab is - TAXATION WITHOUT REPRESENATION.

CHARTER SCHOOLS SANITIZE THE CIVIL RIGHTS MOVEMENT

I have seen big and expensive ads on buses and billboards trumpeting charter schools - all paid for with taxpayer dollars.  I've seen t-shirts worn by Albany residents and printed by the charter school industry that say 'my child, my choice'.  But I'm not sold on charter schools. In fact there is substantial evidence that charter schools do a WORSE job at education than traditional public schools - and now we have this:

A lesson not intended

A March 19th Los Angeles Times article reports on an L.A. charter school that fired two teachers who signed on to a student protest. The students were protesting because school administrators forbade a poem about Emmett Till:

Administrators at a Los Angeles charter school forbade students from reciting a poem about civil rights icon Emmett Till during a Black History Month program recently, saying his story was unsuitable for an assembly of young children. Teachers and students said the administration suggested that the Till case -- in which the teenager was beaten to death in Mississippi after allegedly whistling at a white woman -- was not fitting for a program intended to be celebratory, and that Till's actions could be viewed as sexual harassment.

Emmett Till was an African-American teenager from Chicago, Illinois who was brutally murdered in a region of Mississippi known as the Mississippi Delta in the small town of Money in Leflore County. Emmett Till was fourteen years-old when he was tortured, murdered and mutilated in 1955 during a summer visit to his uncle in Money, Mississippi. His murder was one of the key events that energized the Civil Rights Movement. The main suspects for the crime--both caucasian men--were acquitted, but later admitted to committing the crime. Till's mother had an open casket funeral to let everyone see how her son had been brutally killed. He had been shot and beaten; he was then thrown into the Tallahatchie River with a seventy-five pound cotton gin fan tied to his neck with barbed wire to work as a weight. His body remained in the river for three days until it was discovered and retrieved by two fishermen. A photo of Till's grotequely battered body as it appeared in the casket was put on the cover of JET magazine and sparked civil rights organizing.

This is one of things that has always put me sour on charter schools. No teacher unions, no tenure, no free speech - for students OR teachers. If any teacher doesn't do or say exactly what the private school adminstrators want - YOU'RE FIRED. This week, it's an L.A. charter school sanitizing the civil rights movement and claiming (wrongly I might add) that Emmett Till could be considered to be committing sexual harrassment by whistling at a white woman.

Here's a frighteningly ahistorical quote from one of the school's co-founders and executive adminstrators:

"Our whole goal is how do we get these kids to not look at all of the bad things that could happen to them and instead focus on the process of how do we become the next surgeon or the next politician," said Celerity co-founder and Executive Director Vielka McFarlane. "We don't want to focus on how the history of the country has been checkered but on how do we dress for success, walk proud and celebrate all the accomplishments we've made."

If this is what happens in Los Angeles (not exactly a cultural backwater) we can all just imagine what may be going on in some of the other charter schools in Buffalo, Rochester, Syracuse or Albany.

Hopefully Eliot Spitzer will be talked out of lifting the cap on new charter schools in NYS. Los Angeles has provided a frightening example of how charter schools are more about indoctrination and oppression than education and a complete knowledge of history.

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Charter School Stoopid | 64 comments (64 topical, 0 hidden)
Champlain (none / 0) (#1)
by alfrednewman on Thu Mar 22, 2007 at 08:48:39 AM EST
Do you think that the long history of substandard education in the Albany Public School System has anything to do with the high percentage of Albany residents who have transfered their children to the charter schools?
"What? Me worry? " "whatmeworry.alfred@gmail.com"
Albany Livingston's Middle School. (none / 0) (#2)
by alfrednewman on Thu Mar 22, 2007 at 09:13:08 AM EST
ALBANY -- City school officials have all but agreed to close the long-troubled Livingston middle school in order to avoid having the Education Department force its hand and name it to list of schools that could be shuttered under state guidelines, officials have confirmed.

Livingston potentially faced being designated a School Under Registration Review. SURR schools can be shut down by the state if they don't improve their academic results.

I am not sure what good shutting down Livingston will do. The building itself doesn't teach anything and the teachers are being tranfered- not fired.  I guess this is just another shell game like what they did with Harriet Gibbons.
"What? Me worry? " "whatmeworry.alfred@gmail.com"
[ Parent ]

Where do you get your facts? (none / 0) (#3)
by champlain on Fri Mar 23, 2007 at 04:44:20 PM EST
Yo Alberto, what's up with the "high percentage of Albany parents who have transfered their children to charter schools" crap? Charter schools have been in Albany for eight years and they have about 1100 students - about 80% of which are at the New Covenant Charter School which consistently has low test results and poor performance by any standard of measurement. For all tax dollars you are dumping into charter schools you are getting back mostly crap for your precious tax payments. Maybe you're happy about taxation without represenation, but I think most Albany residents would want a say in how their tax dollars are spent. Citizens get no chance at that kind of oversight or democracy with the charter school tax grab.

Yeah, Livingston has had problems, and the Albany School District is moving to change that school. The Albany School Board has had numerous public meetings about Livingston. You're not going to get public meetings with the charter schools - they do most of their business behind closed doors - even though they are spending your tax dollars. Start clipping some cluepons Alberto.


I take it you're a teacher from the suburbs (none / 0) (#4)
by AlfredMoisiu on Fri Mar 23, 2007 at 05:04:41 PM EST
Your diary entry sounds like talking points developed at the NYSUT palace up on Route 7.

Public schools in general have failed miserably at educating urban children, particularly those from poor and minority backgrounds. You can blame charter schools for the failure of the Albany City School District, but when you do so, you ignore the facts.

There has been very little monetary effect on the district, since the district has been happy to pass along the added costs to the taxpayers. You still have hall monitors making $70,000/yr and there hasn't been a significant layoff of any staff. Even with the same number of staff serving less children, the district continues to fail because it is managed by people more interested in construction than education, they use ineffective methods and cannot enforce any standard of disipline.

Don't blame the "evil suburbanites" or the income level of the students. The district is a failed institution. It's typical that a labor schill would troll the district's failure into a class and race based issue... that's Political Spin 101.

Taxation without representation is exactly what the current model represents. School budget elections are a farce, since the Taylor Law & Triborough Amendment holds collective bargaining agreements sacrosanct. If the taxpayers dare to vote a budget down, the administration stops buying chalk and threatens to shutdown sports programs. Then NYSUT comes to the rescue, spends lots of money to frighten parents into voting yes, and we get more of the same failure.

It doesn't have to be that way, and spending yet more money isn't the answer. I've visited schools in rural India where classes are conducted in primitive conditions by teachers making subsistence wages. The 12 year olds in a class 60-70 that I visited there spoke better English than the average Albany HS student. This is in a region where the per capita income is around $300/year.

We're all being bankrupted because of the extroadinary influence that public employee unions hold over state & municipal government. The state is on the path to bankruptcy, (which will drag many of the 4,000 other NY government bodies with it) which may be the only way for it to crawl out from under the bad law and judgements that we are forced to live with.

Class and race aren't relevant here? (none / 0) (#9)
by champlain on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 07:54:06 AM EST
You claim that I am using political spin. But what about YOUR comment:

"public schools in general have failed miserably at educating urban children, particularly those from poor and minority backgrounds."

Where are your facts?

You show no data, you cite no studies, you link to no reporting.

Are you honestly advocating that a way to educate children from poor and minority areas is to actively ignore civil rights icons? Please tell me you aren't supporting school administrators who say bizarre things like: "don't ...focus on how the history of the country has been checkered but on how do we dress for success"?

What kind of an education is that?

You and I both know the weirdness going on at that L.A. charter school is not education - it's indoctrination and subjugation. The result is two teachers are fired for merely signing on to a STUDENT protest and exercising their right to free speech.

If this is the kind of crap that charter schools push, who can say that charter schools have any place in the American tradition of a free, equal and democratic education? I am sorry to say it - but it appears to me that the charter school movement has been taken over by a group of wealthy, ahistorical, republican ideologues who want to re-segregate schools and shut down free speech and the bill of rights.
http://www.democracyinalbany.com/story/2005/9/24/21322/5042

In fact, the U.S. Department of Education recently tried to bury a report that showed public schools do a better job than charter schools. http://abclocal.go.com/kgo/story?section=education&id=4486894

Your comment just repeats the GOP talking points on the charter school issue. This comes through in every graph where you talk about my being a "labor schill" and your inexplicable fear of employee unions and your bizarre advocacy for schools in India with "primitive conditions" and teachers making "subsistence wages". Is that what you advocate for Albany?  

My understanding is that Albany City school teachers start at about $37K-$38K and have to have pass various state certification tests and also have to have graduate college degrees or have to obtain a graduate degree in education within a specific time frame. Not bad pay, but certainly not a fortune for all of the training and testing a person has to go through to obtain the teaching position. Your demonization of public school teacher unions is right out of the GOP playbook. Having a union and a civil service system and tenure solves lots of sticky problems for a school district - it looks like a charter school in Rotterdam is encountering some of those sticky 'personnel' issues right now:
http://timesunion.com/AspStories/story.asp?category=&storyID=574914&BCCode=&newsdate=3/2 4/2007

I am under no illusions that the Albany City School District has historically been a patronage mill run by the local Democratic Party or those who control that party. I don't defend that. The patronage mill mess must change - and it IS changing. But what I AM READY TO DEFEND is a public school district that has PUBLIC MEETINGS, lots of PUBLIC INVOLVEMENT and PUBLIC VOTES on their budget when they are spending taxpayer dollars. You won't get that with charter schools.

In fact, the Albany City School District encourages public involvement in the school budget process - there is a public budget forum going on today (March 24) and there is another one on March 27th and there were previous ones on March 6th and March 15th: http://www.albanyschools.org/

If the charter schools in Albany had to undergo a public vote on their budgets - every budget would FAIL. How can I predict that? In May 2005 Albany citizens were asked if they support paying for charter schools out of the public school budget. By a vote of 4519 to 996, Albany voters said NO. If charter schools were 100% funded by the rich white suburban ideologues - or if the Albany City School district were held 100% harmless by NYS from the charter school tax grab - then I would have no problem with charter schools poping up. But doing it with Albany taxpayer dollars? NO WAY! That is crazy - bad public policy.

Governor Eliot Spitzer has $2.5 million more for the Albany City School District in his proposed NYS budget as compensation for the plethora of Albany charter schools. The trouble is the charter schools suck about $16.55 million out of the District budget so he's about $14 million SHORT, and I can't understand why (in light of the May 2005 vote) Albany taxpayers stand for it. Albany citizens are paying millions of dollars every year for an EXPERIMENT. We've got the results of that EXPERIMENT and the data shows that charter schools do a BAD JOB. To continue to thrown more and more precious public dollars at charter schools is just bad public policy.

No, I'm not a suburban teacher and I've never been in the NYSUT 'palace' as you call it. But you may want to acknowledge that Albany is a union town and the Capital District strongly supports labor unions. Why are you so afraid of collective bargaining? You're anti-union rap may play well in places like rural Utah - but it doesn't play well in Albany, New York.

[ Parent ]

A few points (none / 0) (#14)
by AlfredMoisiu on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 07:37:45 PM EST
I didn't cite any sources because the point is painfully obvious. But if you insist... see the 1995 digest of educational statistics, which indicates that advanatages urban students score 40% higher than disadvantaged urban students across all ages and races. That data is old, but is what I am familiar with (newer numbers look consistent on the surface)... it's available here:

http://nces.ed.gov/programs/digest/

That's a national figure, which doesn't single out Albany. I believe that the school system in general does not serve disadvantaged children.

The ad hominem attack on the concept of charter schools based on a specific incident in Los Angeles doesn't serve anyone well. Your arguments are fickle, as you stand by the dubious school budget votes (where nothing of substance is actually voted on) while ignoring the waiting lists of parents attempting to get kids into charter schools.

Also, I don't have a problem with labor unions -- in fact I was a steward in one about 5 years ago. Unfortunately, the way that labor law has progressed in New York, particularly the Triborough Amendment, has given public employee unions too much power. A negotiation cannot be fair if one side holds all of the cards.

A teacher or state employee's benefits are now over 50% of the employee's salary -- which is not sustainable. Public employee collective bargaining agreements are driven by veteran employees -- that's why NYC Police recruits start at $25,000/year, teacher starting salaries are poor (but a 25-year veteran makes nearly $100,000 in many districts), and Tier-1 government workers can get lavish pension payments approaching 75% of their work salary.

It's good for the workers -- but at some point the cost to society, in terms of both dollars and poor education, is doing to catch up with us.

[ Parent ]

Labor rights and a free and democratic education (none / 0) (#20)
by champlain on Sun Mar 25, 2007 at 11:47:38 AM EST
I believe a good public school system is one major part of helping poor and disadvantaged children - but a larger system of support needs to be in place to pull children out of poverty (health care, dental care, mental health care, food stamps, shelter assistance, cash assistance, parenting and job training, a supportive community, physical education programs etc.). Public leaders need to articulate real concerns about the poor of Albany and ACT to help pull children out of poverty, and when I say "public" leaders I mean to include ALL persons who have a podium: elected and appointed public officials, but ALSO church leaders, community leaders, business leaders, institution leaders, not-for-profit leaders.

Charter schools alone aren't going to 'fix' Albany's problems with poverty. See my other post in this comment string: http://www.democracyinalbany.com/comments/2007/3/21/201549/033/15#15

But ignoring the problem - or pushing the entire problem on one institution (e.g. Albany City School District) is not a solution.

I admit there are ad hominem elements to my diary on the L.A. charter school. Nevertheless, can I at least get either of the alfreds to agree that the two teachers who were FIRED by the L.A. charter school should be reinstated? Can you honestly argue that the two teachers signing on to this STUDENT protest is a reason to dismiss for cause?

I took parts of my public - compulsory education in New York State before the "Triborough Amendment" was enacted into NYS law. For any reader that doesn't know what the "Triborough Amendment" is, in 1982, the NYS legislature passed the Triborough Amendment to the 1967 Taylor Law. Previously, several school districts simply ceased to honor clauses they disliked in expired teacher union contracts, which led many locals to strike. The Triborough Amendment required school districts and NYS public employers to honor the entire contract until a new agreement was reached, and the number of strikes fell drastically.

I completely disagree with your comment that the amendment gives "public employee unions too much power". The amendment simply holds the old contract in place until a new one is negotiated. Management needs to be held responsible for what they have negotiated - even if it was three years ago. The amendment simply stops the district from abandoning important work rules and using that as a hammer on workers during a long negotiation.

In the pre-Triborough Amendment days I witnessed something truly amazing. It was an informational picket that actually worked. The teaching staff at my school were paid very little and were pushing for a little more in pay. The district was being belligerent and did not want to give. The teachers honored the no-strike Taylor Law and did informational pickets. The teachers had been without a contract for many months and one day during a lunch period something wild got into the air. When lunch was over the students at my school refused to leave the lunch room and attend afternoon classes.

The STUDENTS were engaging in a sit-down strike.

Teachers wandered the halls wondering where their students were. The Superintendent rushed to the lunch room and at first threatened the students but then tried to explain (very poorly) the reasons for the teacher - district dispute. He tried to imply that the students were being used as pawns in the dispute but no student seemed to buy his pro-management arguments and students were not shy about expressing their displeasure with the weak and one-sided explanation. Eventually the students began to realize they were not going to get the straight story from the Superintendent and finally filed out of the room to their afternoon classes, but for a brief period it was an amazing display of student-teacher solidarity.

I learned hundreds of lessons during my compulsory education, one of the most important ones was - don't trust everything management tries to sell you. It was a lesson I never forgot. It was a highlight of my free and democratic education.

The 1982 "Triborough Amendment" does NOT give "one side all the cards". Why would a legislature agree to it and a governor sign it if that was the common perception or practical result? The 1982 amendment was a leveler that smoothed a rough bump in labor-management relations. The amendment cools disputes and keeps the school system running during extended negotiations.

I was lucky in that while my town was not the wealthiest in the county - for various reasons the school district was taken very seriously and was a particular point of pride for the town. My school district often led the county in college acceptance rates and highest SAT scores. The district had a very good reputation and the townspeople were consistently committed to making sacrifices to cooperatively help the school district succeed. The sacrifice didn't end with a tax payment - townspeople gave their time and THEMSELVES to the district in a multitude of ways. The school district was a focal point and everyone wanted to be a part of it.

I see a lot of commitment to the Albany district - but unfortunately the charter schools have brought a high volume divisiveness that inhibits an atmosphere of good will and cooperation.

I don't know why you bring the NYC police starting salaries into a charter school discussion - the NYC police unions need to fix that problem and stop rolling over for management. The NYC police unions have a solidarity problem they need to fix. I don't agree that teacher starting salaries are poor, and I don't see why you think paying a 25-year teaching veteran a good salary for their experience is a problem. The veterans have the experience and I would posit that the vast majority deserve the high pay for what they bring to the classroom.

By the way, Tier 1 of the NYSERS and NYSTRS ended in 1976, that was over 30 years ago. The Tier 1 retirees won't drain the pension system.  NYSERS has a $140.5 billion fund value and NYSTRS has $91.5 billion fund value. I don't think there is any chance of these becoming bankrupt pension funds. They are too well-managed. What kind of retirement systems do charter school teachers have? If they have ANY - they are down right puny in comparison, and they don't benefit from the professional investment management and the pooling of resources of the public employee systems.

I don't see any citations in regard to your claim  "a teacher or state employee's benefits are now over 50% of the employee's salary" - I think you are high on that one. Very high.

You may be spending too much time reading Manhattan Institute propaganda.

Charter schools as they have been implemented in Albany run counter to the American tradition of a free and democratic education. Charter schools put taxpayer dollars in the hands of ideologues who have very little connection to the districts they impose their pedagogical views on.

You claim there are waiting lists for the charter schools - that is because they don't have the capacity to meet the promises of their massive advertising campaign that is paid for with taxpayer dollars. Maybe you've seen the newspaper ads and billboards and bus placards and mailers - all paid for with tax dollars. It's a sad situation and it is time for a serious change.

[ Parent ]

Free and Democratic education (none / 0) (#21)
by alfrednewman on Sun Mar 25, 2007 at 12:43:51 PM EST

I don't think that there is really any question that there Albany City Schools have never operated on any principle even close to being free and democratic.  

Do you really think that being able to pass judgment on less than one tenth of one percent of a $163,000,000 budget is an example of "democracy?"

Champlain: I do understand how people get offended when they are forced to contribute their money to organizations who have political agendas. Public school teachers do not have the option to not belong to a union. Union "agency fees" are automatic and mandatory.  

Can you explain to me how the teachers union that you are so fond of is an example of being "free and democratic"?  At the very least Charter Schools teachers have more freedoms then an Albany Public School teacher.  They have the right to organize or the right not to.

You have shown exactly what's wrong with the teachers unions.  They use the students as pawns.  In my school district in 1980 there was a union dispute. I clearly remember the class being told how unfair the administration was and how the parents must not care because the town had once again refused to pass the budget.

My math teacher was the union president. He didn't teach. He didn't need to.

When your school had a sit down strike was it because the students were a party to the negotiations?  Did the students have a representative at the table? No? Then they were used by the teachers as pawns.

I am more than familiar with the Taylor laws. My father was a CSEA local president. When my father's local voted to strike he put his liberty on the line and would have gone to jail had they walked out.  He didn't connive a bunch of children to do it for him.

Why of course, we need more support systems before we can teach the little black kids from the inner city. Awe, we cant teach unless we have more money- even though we teach 1,100 fewer kids than we did when we were the only game in town.

Wrong. Our schools suck because we have people that don't give a shit. And their apologists.

Champlain: you interest me.  How come you have a problem with Jennings, Commisso and the rest of the local political thugs but you apparently have no problem with the secretive school district who picks our pockets for just about the same amount as the city but answers to no one and is guaranteeing that the children of Albany have no future except for jail and welfare?
"What? Me worry? " "whatmeworry.alfred@gmail.com"
[ Parent ]

Sorry about your math teacher (none / 0) (#24)
by champlain on Sun Mar 25, 2007 at 01:24:05 PM EST
That's too bad. I think your school district should have disciplined or dismissed him if he didn't teach. You got a raw deal.

I was very lucky, all of my math teachers in my district were very good and I wasn't an easy student to teach.

Maybe it is just my perspective but I never see the Albany School District as secretive, they seem to have a shitload of data on their website. They seem to have a lot more public meetings than other school districts. I also see Dr. Joseph regularly commenting in the media. I am also glad she has started to take the wood to some of those charter school blowhards.

I also have to disagree with you calling me out as an apologist. While I'd like to see the Albany School District succeed, I've don't automatically agree with all their decisions or all the comments made by their board members. There appears to be a lot of pitched debate at some of the board meetings. There also seems to be a lot of heavy competition when school board elections happen.

Those are good things.

Maybe you should run if you feel so strongly.

[ Parent ]

Champlain: (none / 0) (#26)
by alfrednewman on Sun Mar 25, 2007 at 06:13:14 PM EST
You can't fire a teacher for being a lazy and we both know it. Once they are past their probation they can sail through life without a care.

If you think the Albany City Schools are not being secretive then I have a challenge for you.  It will be very easy to prove me wrong and I will publically admit that I have jumped to conclusions.

By the end of business tomorrow I want you to post the following information:

  1. Number of full time employees in the Albany City School District.
  2. The number of those full time employees that are not full time teachers.
  3. The number of "teachers aids"

You have pointed out that the school district is having public budget meetings coming up so that information should be at the tip of the school administrations fingers.

And I want it posted for one very important reason.  I suspect that you are a little more than what you claim.  I want you to have to get this information through the same channels that I have already tried to get it through.

While you have the Superintendent on the phone why don't you ask her when the last time that the school districts facilities committee met?  See a few years back they had a facilities committee set up.  They asked the citizens to participate. A friend of mine was on it.  It hasn't met in YEARS.  So they got the citizens imput. They didn't like it. So they never asked for the taxpayers to participate again.

Did you know that is how the school district operates? Is this the "democratic" way?  Those are the "good things" aint they?

I would run for school board but frankly my wife and I hope to have kids so in a couple of years and we have already started house hunting. And as more than one school board member will tell you, you cant serve on the board if you don't live in the district.

Thats right, Im taking school district performance into consideration when I am looking for a home- just like everyone else.
"What? Me worry? " "whatmeworry.alfred@gmail.com"
[ Parent ]

You're funny Al (none / 0) (#29)
by champlain on Mon Mar 26, 2007 at 05:37:16 PM EST
Very funny.

I don't think I'm inclined to do your research for you to help you with your long list of complaints about Dr. Joseph and the Albany School District.

You're a taxpayer - send the District an email:

http://www.albanyschools.com/district/feedback.htm

Seems like you have a lot of gripes: polling places not clean and well-lighted; Livingston; not enough facilities committee meetings for your taste; Harriet Gibbons.

If you want to complain about the school budget - why don't you attend one of the FOUR budget forums the Albany City School District has been holding? http://www.albanyschools.com

Have you been having lunch with that Tom Carroll guy?  Your overheated arguments sound a lot like his. http://www.democracyinalbany.com/story/2005/6/3/81718/91006

If you are so hot on the Brighter Choice school why don't you try and run for their board?

Oh yeah, the Brighter Choice board isn't democratically ELECTED - you have to be deemed `acceptable' by the charter school crowd to have any say in how that school is run. I'm not sure if you're wealthy enough for that crowd - they have pretty rich tastes.

Also, Brighter Choice doesn't seem to have many actual Albany residents on the Brighter Choice board (looks like only 1 out of 14 actually live in Albany). Funny how that works, eh Al?

I searched and searched for financial info on the Brighter Choice website as I am VERY CURIOUS how they spend their millions in Albany taxpayer dollars - strangely, I didn't find ANY financial materials on the Brighter Choice site. Surprise, surprise.

Maybe you want to ask the Brighter Choice folks why they have no financial info on their site? info@brighterchoice.org

After all, it is YOUR tax dollars they are spending...

But all you have to do is cruise the internet a little and POW! the answers suddenly start to appear. Tom Carroll uses a "foundation" known as the 'Foundation for Education Reform and Accountabilty' to pay himself $237K in salary and benefits.

That was just for 2005.  The foundation also paid Tommy's pal Brian Backstrom $182K in salary and benefits in 2005. Looks like selling that charter school thing is a VERY lucrative bidness. Hell, I bet Tommy's salary and bennies are up over $300,000 for 2007! Looks like one of Tommy's favorite charities is HIMSELF!

How about we make a bet to see if Tommy breaks $300K in salary and benefits from his 'charitable foundation' for 2007? Loser buys the yummy stout at Mahar's...  What'dya say?

Gosh, those charter school guys... they're just swell.

And lookie here. One of the 'contributors' to Tommy's foundation - why it's the BRIGHTER CHOICE FOUNDATION - with a sweet contribution of $100K. Thank god the white collar white guys are riding in from Clifton Park on their white stallions to save Albanians from the horrors of the evil Albany School District. Who would buy up all those McMansions in Clifton Park if it wasn't for the charter school ideologues like Tommy and Bri paying themselves those fat salaries while they scold the Albany School District types?

In contrast to the mysterious ways of the Brighter Choice Schools, the Albany City School District sends out a newsletter to Albany voters about their budgets with loads of financial information:

http://www.albanyschools.com/Budget/Newsletter.April2006.pdf

http://www.albanyschools.com/Budget/CapEd.Revised.Budget.pdf

If you want to get some more talking points from charter school king Tommy W. Carroll - you can email him at `tcarroll32@aol.com'  

Or maybe you want to drop a card up to Tommy's McMansion in CLIFTON PARK:

32 Pinehurst Drive, CLIFTON PARK, NY 12065

It cracks me up that you disparage me and call me a `partisan' - check out the partisan screed Tommy recently wrote for the NY Sun: http://www.nysun.com/article/42630

From the looks of your comments on this thread you may be one of his regular readers. I'm sure Tommy's inability to understand the term `unfair labor practice' is causing a lot of sticky problems for his charter school crowd.

You keep on foaming about Harriet Gibbons High School. It looks to me that Harriet Gibbons is a special effort by the District to keep at-risk 9th graders in high school and eventually try and get them to college. It looks like a special effort with intensive tutoring to keep these kids from dropping out:

http://www.albanyschools.org/schools/gibbonshighschool/harrietgibbons.htm

I've don't see why you have such a big problem with that. You portray it as some kind of `dodge' by the District. Why all the foaming at the mouth?

I've already posted about the Albany County Dem. Committee having used the school district as a patronage mill in the past - it takes a long time and a lot of effort to sweep that crap out of the system. I'm not going to defend past patronage - that kind of bull needs to stop. If you want to post about patronage abuses - you might try taking a closer look at the City of Albany:

http://www.democracyinalbany.com/story/2005/6/3/82039/28805

Toodles.  Tell Tommy and Bri 'Hi' for me.

[ Parent ]

1/10 of 1 percent is deMOCKracy (none / 0) (#32)
by alfrednewman on Mon Mar 26, 2007 at 07:27:33 PM EST

Late posting tonight Champ.  Did it take the teachers union that long to come up with your response?

I am not surprised that you didn't want to get the information that I challenged you to get. Regular tax payers can't get this stuff unless they go to a meeting that is being taped and recorded for review. Attendance is taken at these as we both know. Maybe someone read this and go ask.  Bet they cant get it there either.

I am also not surprised that you reacted with such hostility to the mention of the long ignored facilities committee.  "not enough facilities committee meetings for your taste"  You funny. Not enough meetings for my taste.  You are the one that brought up "democracy" and now you are getting mad when I point out that when the citizens participate the school district does what it can to limit that involvement.

I don't think that I said the polling places were not clean.  I couldn't tell because if they were clean or not. They were not "well-lighted" they were not "lighted" at all.  I could have been walking along a path of rose peddles and wouldn't have been able to tell.

Unlike most people who are critical of the school system I don't think I have said anything negative about Dr Joseph.  Some people take issue with how she acquired the job. I couldn't care less.  Frankly all she is able to do is move those little deck chairs around.   The ship is still sinking.  

Was that a school board president dressed like a woman trying to get into the life boat?

Is it really "my gripe" that Livingston is being closed down before it drags the rest of the district into state control?  Is it really "my gripe" that those kids in the "cohort of purgatory" being hidden at Gibbons so they are not counted for the state when they drop out or fail the 9th grade?  Did you really call that "my gripe?"  That's great- the true Champlain comes out!   The Champion of the Failuire!

Damn right, its MY GRIPE, although it should be the gripe of everyone.

Our school in a one hundred and seventy million dollar failure and the best thing that could ever happen is for the state to come in and take it over.  Then the children would have the opportunity to have a decent public school education.

I didn't call you a partisan.  I called you an apologist of this massive failure. The least you could do is get my name calling right.

I was thinking of calling up Dr Joseph and asking her for information. But then I thought about the advice that the President of the Albany school board gave the good citizens like myself in August of 2005.

Albany school board president quits
Scott Wexler steps down because he is moving to a house in the suburbs
Saturday, August 13, 2005   Page: B7
ALBANY - Scott Wexler, president of the city school board, resigned Friday because he's purchasing a home in Delmar. His resignation is effective immediately.

And it seems that you have also taken Wexler's advice.  You said that you don't live in Albany.
"What? Me worry? " "whatmeworry.alfred@gmail.com"
[ Parent ]

Just the facts (none / 0) (#35)
by champlain on Tue Mar 27, 2007 at 04:03:18 AM EST
Just trying to put some of the facts out there. Again, I am not connected to NYSUT, I am not a teacher and I never said I lived in the suburbs.

In my opinion the charter school swells are using the charter school schemes to feather a nice plush bed for themselves and trying to use Albany taxpayer dollars to do it. They may set up 'not-for-profit foundations' but the thing they emphasis is the PROFIT - which goes right in their POCKETS.

Hey alfred, how come you wouldn't take my bet? I thought you were a regular at Mahar's? How about we raise it a little and I say charter school king Tommy Carroll's salary and bennies will be up over $325,000 for 2007? Would that make you more inclined to accept my wager?

Just think of that yummy stout...

[ Parent ]

Actually (none / 0) (#37)
by alfrednewman on Tue Mar 27, 2007 at 10:45:39 AM EST
I couldn't care less what Tommy Carroll's salary is or what the bennies will be for 2007.  Good for him working so hard over the years. I think if nothing else it shows how important a good education is in life.  Do you think that Tom Carroll would be where he is now in life had he attended Albany City Schools?

Opps wait, thats the OLD AEN speaking.  Yes, yes, I can see it all so clearly now. Evil Tommy.  EV-IL! Why he is taking the money right out of the mouths of NYSUT and making it so much harder to teach.  Forgive me, I know how important it is to make sure that every kid (who comes from a family that cant move or afford private school) has an equal education.  Because equality and democracy is more important to our society then quality.  

And Champ, my good friend, I would be perfectly happy to buy you a stout at Mahars any time. We can talk about how you can fix me up and get me on the $1,700,000 tit.
"What? Me worry? " "whatmeworry.alfred@gmail.com"
[ Parent ]

Where Tommy gets his money (none / 0) (#39)
by champlain on Wed Mar 28, 2007 at 12:26:31 AM EST
He's not taking money out of the mouth of NYSUT as you say. Tommy is taking Albany taxpayer dollars to push his charter school schemes. That's my biggest gripe. Who elected Tommy to spend Albany tax dollars? NOBODY!

Alfreds can try to defocus the discussion and try to make it all about the 'ev-il' NYSUT, but Tommy's got it rigged so the charter school swells suck out millions of Albany tax dollars and spend them with NO LOCAL OVERSIGHT AND NO PUBLIC ACCOUNTABILITY.

It's BAD policy and a BAD scheme that no amount of yummy stout @ Mahars will make you forget.

[ Parent ]

You are 100% correct (none / 0) (#40)
by alfrednewman on Wed Mar 28, 2007 at 12:05:54 PM EST
Its all about the oversight.  Finally something that Champlain and I can agree on!  Its all about the oversight!  

Albany schools are in the shape of they are because of management oversight!

Oversight is what makes Albany Public Schools cost $1,700,000 and allows them to not teach!

Its the oversight of the schools!

Its the oversight of the citizens regarding albany public  education!

Its the oversight and no public accountability!

Definitions of Oversight:

  1. an unintentional omission resulting from failure to notice something

  2. supervision: management by overseeing the performance or operation of a person or group

  3. a mistake resulting from inattention

 
"What? Me worry? " "whatmeworry.alfred@gmail.com"
[ Parent ]
What's up with the filibuster (none / 0) (#33)
by ObnoxioTheClown on Mon Mar 26, 2007 at 07:47:58 PM EST
Nobody really gives a shit about posts you put up two years ago. Do you actually keep an index of all of this drivel?

And where you get off telling people that they have too many gripes when you're writing needlessly long missives with 50 useless links to nowhere?

...and posting the personal addresses of people whom you have some sort of beef with in a public form is pretty fucking immature. Even an immature asshole like me can see that. I'd like to send a letter to you... what's you room number at NYSUT HQ? Or your home address in a 'burbs -- since your precious little ones have to go to a nice comfy suburban school?

You're just an angry little person who's afraid of change.

[ Parent ]

Hello friend (none / 0) (#36)
by champlain on Tue Mar 27, 2007 at 04:17:15 AM EST
I didn't think there was any limit to the length of comments on DIA. IMHO my web links are relevant -- I bring up recent history because it is connected to the charter school tax grab and the hugely expensive propaganda campaign the charter school types are using and paying for with tax dollars.

I admit I occasionally get angry about the attack of the charter schools on Albany - but mostly it just makes me sad. I see it as a theft of public tax dollars being funneled to a bunch of white wealthy suburban right-wing ideologues who want to wrest local control of the Albany School District from Albanians because the Albanians don't 'think right'. Again, I'd have no problem with charter school EXPERIMENT if the Albany School District was held harmless. I'm all for change, but you'll excuse me if I don't think this charter school tax grab is a change in the right direction.

Thanks for weighing in on the diary.

[ Parent ]

This is a waste of time... but what the heck (none / 0) (#23)
by AlfredMoisiu on Sun Mar 25, 2007 at 01:11:01 PM EST
"can I at least get either of the alfreds to agree that the two teachers who were FIRED by the L.A. charter school should be reinstated?"

I don't know enough about that specific incident to side with anyone.

"I don't know why you bring the NYC police starting salaries into a charter school discussion"

Because the situation is analogous. Rember analogies? The NYPD union leadership screws over the new people year after year in favor of improved retirement benefits. That's the same reason why new teacher salaries are far too low and veteran teachers (who are mostly gone now) have much better pensions.

"I don't see any citations in regard to your claim  "a teacher or state employee's benefits are now over 50% of the employee's salary" - I think you are high on that one. Very high."

Not at all... The total for FY06-07 is 49.14%... it's projected to be 51.4% for FY07-08.

http://www.osc.state.ny.us/agencies/abulls/a565.htm

These figures are for state employees are skewed towards costs in the Albany area. School districts vary according to things like health benefit rates. Districts in western NY and NYC are probably higher (2-5%); schools in this area are probable somewhat lower (1-2%)

"I completely disagree with your comment that the amendment gives "public employee unions too much power"."

You're entitled to your opinion. But talk to any executive in any state, municipal, special district or public authority and they will disagree.

---

Look, I don't have a problem with teachers... But when employees of a failed system who cannot be fired essentially control an undemocratic process with unlimited taxing authority, that's a problem.

Also, education & poverty are not the same. Poverty trends with low academic achievement, but is not causative. Poor does not have to mean ignorant.


[ Parent ]

Interesting (none / 0) (#5)
by alfrednewman on Fri Mar 23, 2007 at 05:23:14 PM EST
So you don't consider 20 plus percent transfer rate high. OK, so its not as high as the percentage of people who have completly turned their backs on Albany and moved to a better school district.

When I was a little kid my parents moved to a town because it had the best public school in the area. Can you imagin a family doing that now?  I certainly can't.  I know a dozen who moved out of Albany because they had kids.

The goal Champlain, should be quality education. And it is not happening here.  Our Super is playing word games to avoid being taken over by the state.  Take Harriet Gibbons for example.  Those kids are not counted as 9th graders as far as the state in concerned. So when they have to repeat the 9th grade it wont count against the school system.

Cant fix "Livingston?" Well lets just have a new school and call it something else.  If this isnt a clasic case of rearraging the deck chairs on the Titanic I am not sure what is.

New Covenant was the worst proposal and we all know that they were intentionally picked by people who hoped they would fail.  Even so, I think they outrank four Albany schools.

Lets talk funding here for a second.  According to the people at Brighter Choices Albany Public Schools gets paid over 3K per student that they no longer have to teach.

SO they get paid 3,300,000 (based on your number) not to teach. DAMN.

Now lets look at the last budget vote. According to the Albany School Board we were only allowed to vote on about 100K of the 163 million dollar budget. Seems to me that if I don't get a real say on the budget the least they could do is send more kids to the Charter Schools so the overall cost of failure to Albany would be less.

And Champlain, keep screaming about the performace of the Charters while you still can. I am willing to bet that Brighter Choices will kick ass.
"What? Me worry? " "whatmeworry.alfred@gmail.com"

The Brighter Choice types works a rigged system (none / 0) (#10)
by champlain on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 09:00:56 AM EST
The two Brighter Choice schools cherry-pick their students and by the way they have less than 2% of Albany public school enrollment. Not to mention the fact the Brighter Choice school is run by wealthy white ideologues from Clifton Park who are using Albany taxpayer dollars for their little EXPERIMENT.
http://www.democracyinalbany.com/story/2005/9/24/21322/5042

Hey, if Brighter Choice gets good results - that is great for them.  But why shouldn't they get some good results - they've rigged the system so charter schools get every possible advantage and the Albany City School district pays the big fat bill. And by extension the Albany taxpayer ends up paying. All so some self-satisfied twits can sit on their duff up in Clifton Park and work their twisted scheme to rip off Albany taxpayers.

I know I shouldn't be surprised as you are always happy to play the dupe for the oligarchs and the plutocrats. BUT THEY ARE USING YOUR TAX DOLLARS to do it.

I'd think you would want some public accountablility, public participation and public transparancy for your tax payment.

Have fun with that new property reassessment - courtesy of the Jerry-Jimmy-Frankie-Nicky-Joey wrecking crew. http://www.democracyinalbany.com/comments/2007/3/7/181254/0533/3#3

A bigger and bigger portion of your tax bill will be going to the charter school EXPERIMENT.

[ Parent ]

Experiments and proven failures (none / 0) (#12)
by alfrednewman on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 09:48:10 AM EST
Champlain:

The goal should be to have quality education. Can we agree to that?

When you look at the way the way Albany public has been run you will note that they have been just about the most expensive per student in the area and they have the worst results in the area. Livingston is being shut down. Hackett has a 80% failure rate in English in the 8th grade.

Im not sure why you think that the money belongs to the Albany City schools. It belongs to the tax payers. Had the city schools been doing their jobs there wouldnt be a demand for Charter Schools.

It is astounding that Albany teaches- by your numbers- 1,100 less students but the costs go up consistantly. The school also gets paid 3,000 plus per student that they don't teach.

So here is an example of the public accountability that you insist I have based on the Small Cities School bill that allows me to vote on my budget.

1) Anything the school board contracts for is not subject to the budget vote. From school supplies, to athletics, to drivers ed, to Adult education absolutley nothing is subject to the voters.  During last years budget threats the school board announced that if the budget went to contingency there would be a couple hall monitors laid off and there would be a grand savings of 100,000.  

So if I get to vote on only 100,000 of the budget out of 163,000,000 is there really public accountability?

2) Two years ago I contacted the school system with this one simple questions.  How many full time employees are not teachers.  This was asked the day after the people voted. Do you know how many full time employees there are in the school district?

Neither do they. Or they are liars.

Tell you what Champ. Why don't you get the information and post it here.
"What? Me worry? " "whatmeworry.alfred@gmail.com"
[ Parent ]

The goal (none / 0) (#15)
by champlain on Sun Mar 25, 2007 at 05:00:10 AM EST
Of course the goal is quality education. My impression is that the Albany School District tries very hard to do that. Test scores aren't the only measure of a quality school district. The alfreds seem to want to argue that the main reason Albany test scores don't equal those of North Colonie or Bethlehem or Guilderland is teacher labor agreements and pensions. The alfreds argue charter schools are the solution.

I would argue poverty is the main issues affecting Albany district scores. Approximately thirty percent of children ages 1-18 in Albany live in poverty, that's according to the U.S. Census. I think the charter school types consistently fail to acknowledge this simple fact. The substantial poverty in the downtown areas of Albany is real and mostly ignored by the charter school types. In my view that makes the alfreds arguments incomplete, hollow and mostly off point.

New Covenant Charter School has the same problems with a poor student population as do Giffen, Livingston, Arbor Hill, Sheridan and others.

There is no easy 'fix' to an urban poor population, but I've known dozens of people who have worked in Albany neighborhoods for years trying to address poverty issues. It is a struggle. Albany would be better served if the city and county would work more cooperatively with the District and not-for-profits and put the appropriate focus on poverty that Albany needs. I've seen some minor success over the years, but the charter schools types have been divisive and have usually poisoned the discussions/actions rather than advanced the attack on the causes of poverty. The charter school types appear to conveniently ignore the debilitating effects of a life of scarcity and deprivation.

The charter school types consistently defocus the discourse away from a main problem: poverty.

I have even heard various members of the Albany School Board dismiss or discount poverty as a main problem with the District, luckily the views of those members seem to have little weight.

OF COURSE a quality education is the goal - but cutting up precious Albany taxpayer dollars into a smaller and smaller pie by creating a separate (yet taxpayer funded) school system does not appear to be a viable solution for a high poverty urban population like Albany's.

I always go back to the May 2005 vote. When Albany voters were asked if they support paying for charter schools out of the public school budget they said NO by a vote of 4519 to 996.

I am usually frustrated with Fred Lebrun's colunms in the Albany Times Union - but today he hits it on the head:

The tyranny of a powerful minority is propelling charter schools over the will of the majoirty in this state, and trying to keep the table tilted in favor of imposing charter schools in districts that may not want them. That's indefensible, but they're getting away with it because the governor is aiding and abetting.
http://www.timesunion.com/AspStories/story.asp?storyID=575088&TextPage=1

[ Parent ]

Precious taxpayer dollars (none / 0) (#19)
by alfrednewman on Sun Mar 25, 2007 at 11:03:58 AM EST
Champion:

Don't you find it difficult being an apologist for a hundred and sixty million dollar plus a year failure? How many hundreds of millions of the "precious Albany taxpayer dollars" has been flushed down the crapper on an unfixable city school district?  How many millions of "precious Albany taxpart dollars" has been flushed down the toilet known as Livingston?

You are absolutely correct, test scores are not the only measure of a quality education. Graduation rate is also important. Albany has low test scores and a low graduation rate.  And before you try to defend the inflated graduation rates please understand that I do know a few Albany teachers well and know how they have been cooking that number as well.

Care to discuss the status of Harriet Gibbons students?

If the amount of money spent on teachers was an indication of a quality school district then Albany would be the MIT of area schools. Our teachers have the highest salaries. However, money is not an indication because Albany isn't the MIT of area schools, is it?

Ok, so poverty is a factor. 80% of Albany's school children do not live in poverty yet 80% of Albany City School children in the 8th grade can not read or write to New York State Standards.   In Amsterdam, which has a Spanish as the primary language population of 30+- percent and an under-18 poverty rate of probably approaching 40% the test scores are significantly higher than Albany's.  

Why is it that a poorer school district in a poorer city with a higher percentage of non-English speaking students does better in 8th grade English than Albany does?  Por Que?

"Urban Poverty" is a convenient excuse that people use to excuse failure. The students are poor. The students are black. So we can't teach them.  You point out the stats. You point out where they are from. That's exactly what you are saying. Your attitude smacks of racism. White poor kids learn to read and write.  Poor black kids live in poverty and no one expects them to do anything but end up in jail and on welfare.  Your attitude is typical of what I have found in my white upperclass neighborhood.  We are liberal whites voting for the school budget because we want to show everyone how "caring" we are. If we have children we will sell our house and move to a better district or send our children to private schools.    

If a suburban district had the same test scores as Albany's there would be an angry mob with boiling tar and feathers looking for administrators and union officials.

I had an interesting conversation with a woman I know who is the retired Superintendent for one of the local school districts. She says that it is Albany's administration that is the problem. In her district bad teachers were removed or encouraged to retire. Not here in Albany. I wish I could tell you her name, the district  and exactly what she said, but I can't.

You can bring up a non-binding bullshit vote all you want. Less than 10% of the eligible voters cast a ballot.  I think a better indication is how many families with children either moved out of Albany because they had the ability to or have chosen to send their children to a non- public school district school.  Don't you think that is a more reasonable measure of peoples attitudes?

I wonder how many of those 4,519 people who voted are either employed by the school district or has a family member that works for the district.  What do you think that number is?  I also have to wonder how many of those 4,519 people own their own homes and have to directly pay their school tax bill.  

You can always go back to the May 2005 vote but you know just as well as I do that it is propaganda that is used to fool the gullible by apologists.

I have gotten you to agree that quality education is the goal.  Can we also agree that if the Albany City School district had better test scores and graduation rates that there wouldn't be such a substantial demand for Charter Schools in Albany?       

I know this is a leading question. In 1997 the then head of the Griffin Elementary PTA took the $2,000 Brighter Choices voucher and got her kid out of the Griffin and into a private school.
"What? Me worry? " "whatmeworry.alfred@gmail.com"
[ Parent ]

Propaganda? Nah... it's called democracy (none / 0) (#22)
by champlain on Sun Mar 25, 2007 at 12:51:29 PM EST
Again, the May 2005 public vote was not propaganda. It is called democracy.

That is what we are SUPPOSED to do with public dollars.  In democracies we vote on things. We don't just give precious taxpayer dollars to suburban ideologues with a malevolent agenda and expensive ad campaign that highlights every failing of the school district and is completely silent on every accomplishment.

I don't believe the Albany City School District is a failure or "unfixable". Thank you for at least acknowledging that poverty is a factor. I think where we still differ is HOW MUCH of a factor it is.

I'm sorry if you think my argument "smacks of racism". You may want to re-read the initial diary.

I don't want to use urban poverty as an "excuse". I'd like Albany to do everything it can to eliminate it's pockets of poverty. Simple as that. I think a free and democratic education is a big and important part of eliminating poverty.
http://www.democracyinalbany.com/story/2007/2/25/4557/46705

If charter schools can be part of the solution then I am all for them - but all I see from the Brighter Choice types is propaganda and misleading ads - oh, and lets not forget Gerald Reynolds:
http://www.democracyinalbany.com/story/2005/9/24/21322/5042

Looks like the only local support Reynolds got besides the Brighter Choice types was Michael Brown
http://www.democracyinalbany.com/story/2005/9/25/65926/1874
 - you remember Mike Brown - the former City Councilmember who pleaded the fifth amendment not to incriminate himself some 172 times in response to a civil rights lawsuit on violations of election laws from his actions in 2004.
http://www.democracyinalbany.com/story/2005/7/21/31231/7219

What a frickin loon Reynolds was. But what do you expect - he's bought and paid for by the charter school industry.

I don't put any pre-judgment on any student, black or white, poor or wealthy. But I won't ignore the FACTS.  And the facts are that Albany is a district with a significant problem with poverty. It's not an excuse. It is a fact.

Tenured teachers can be disciplined or dismissed if school administrators prove just cause in a due-process hearing. Teachers are on probation for their first three years in the classroom and become eligible for tenure through a recommendation of the superintendent and a vote by the school board. If the Albany district protects bad teachers I won't defend that. But until you cite something else more than third- hand info, you'll allow me to take your comments with a grain of salt.

It's unfortunate that you think a public vote is "bullshit". But that's the way we do things in America. Where are you from?

[ Parent ]

Re: Democracy (none / 0) (#25)
by AlfredMoisiu on Sun Mar 25, 2007 at 01:28:27 PM EST
"teachers can be disciplined or dismissed if school administrators prove just cause in a due-process hearing. Teachers are on probation for their first three years in the classroom and become eligible for tenure through a recommendation of the superintendent and a vote by the school board."

Sure... that process is beyond drawn out and expensive -- it takes over years. The Altamont Enterprise had a feature two weeks ago about an clearly "firable" incident in the Voorheesville School district, which was drawn out (by a suspended teacher collecting full pay) for over three years, which is a common length of such a proceeding.

"I don't believe the Albany City School District is a failure or "unfixable"."

Parents do. That's why they are leaving the city. The people who run the school district want to persist with the status quo. That's why charter schools exist -- the people running the current system refuse to change and are too dug in.

"Again, the May 2005 public vote was not propaganda. It is called democracy."

It's a mockery of democracy. School elections are non-partisan votes where the only one side has a vested interest in the outcome. For all of the Mayor's faults, everyone knows who he is and can hold him accountable at the polls. 8/10 Albany residents never heard of Eva Joseph and can't do anything about her if they did!

[ Parent ]

Where was management in Voorhesville? (none / 0) (#46)
by champlain on Fri Mar 30, 2007 at 09:08:11 PM EST
You claim a 3201 hearing took three years to get decided. Why did management let it drag out that long? Management has to be agressive about pushing a hearing throught to completion.

Oh yeah, maybe managment was too busy embezzling funds from the Voorhesville School District to bother to prosecute the 3201 hearing:

http://www.northcountrygazette.org/articles/012406MissingFunds.html

The former Voorheesville school district superintendent and assistant superintendent inappropriately paid themselves $216,000 for leave and other employment benefits, according to an audit report of the New York State Comptroller and Voorheesville district officials announced they have filed a civil lawsuit based on the Comptroller's findings to recover the funds.

That might be a reason for the three-year long hearing. Too much criminal activity by school management.

[ Parent ]

Forgot to add... (none / 0) (#47)
by champlain on Fri Mar 30, 2007 at 09:19:24 PM EST
The Voorheesville Superintendent and Assistant Superintendent were referred to the Albany County District Attorney for possible criminal prosecution.

Dr. Eva Joseph isn't looking half bad now, is she?

[ Parent ]

Lets look at the numbers and we see (none / 0) (#48)
by alfrednewman on Fri Mar 30, 2007 at 11:19:10 PM EST
Yes, she looks really bad!

Albany Middle Schools.
8th Grade reading 80% read BELOW NYS standards.

Ranked: Persistently Dangerous.
Percentage to be closed before State steps in 50%.

Number of Charter Schools in operation or proposed in Albany: Lots.

Number of families who moved from V'Ville to Albany to send kids to Albany Public Schools- Not a damn one.

Cost per student: $18,000 plus

V'ville
8th Grade 76% reading reading ABOVE NYS standard

Ranked: Not dangerous let alone persistently
Percentage to be closed before the State steps in not a damn one.

Number of Charter Schools in operation or proposed in V'Ville: Not a damn one.

Number of families who moved to V'Ville from Albany so kids could go to V'ville schools: Lots.

Cost per student 15,100


Now the fun part: If V'ville's shifty administration was to have ran Albany's school the net effect would be the following:

50,000,000+- savings to the tax payers.
Way better educated children.

So really, even a crooked administration in V'ville in more effective that the current administration in Albany!
"What? Me worry? " "whatmeworry.alfred@gmail.com"
[ Parent ]

Opps (none / 0) (#49)
by alfrednewman on Fri Mar 30, 2007 at 11:24:23 PM EST
Sorry, made a fuzzy math mistake at 2am

Not 50,000,000, it would be only a 33,000,000 savings, lets figure a 3,000,000 bonus to the administration for a job well done and you still get a 30,000,000 savings.

"What? Me worry? " "whatmeworry.alfred@gmail.com"
[ Parent ]

You're talking smack (none / 0) (#53)
by champlain on Sat Mar 31, 2007 at 10:48:35 AM EST
As usual, you're arguments are veering off into fantasy land.

Check the POVERTY rates in Voorheesville versus Albany. Check how many kids qualify for a free lunch or reduced price lunch.

You're arguments are barely linked to reality.

Albany kids have LESS resources, financial and otherwise.  The Albany City School District tries hard to make up for that with small class sizes, more technology to breach the digital divide, breakfast and lunch programs, magnet and Montessori schools, and super-active PTA's.  Albany County Opportunity, Inc. runs the head start program. But the war on poverty is a tough battle and gains are very hard to come by. The poverty rates put Albany kids at an immediate disadvantage straight from birth and the only way that can be overcome is with a consistent level of effort and focus. An essential component is integrated child support among the parents, the school district, not-for-profits, the City and the County - getting that integrated support can be a problem in Albany. Hizzoner has a grand time trying to make the school district his whipping post - but citizens know better than to pay any attention to the Tan One's diversions.

The charter schools invading the City cut up already limited resources and create yet another 'separate' school system in Albany. Charter schools take the focus off fostering opportunity for Albany's kids and put the focus on politics, division, high-volume attacks, and BLAME. And you are one of the charter school swells biggest cheerleaders. Why? What do charter school blowhards from Clifton Park like Tommy Carroll bring to Albany other than a divisiveness bordering on the hysterical?

[ Parent ]

What do charter school blow hards bring (none / 0) (#54)
by alfrednewman on Sat Mar 31, 2007 at 02:01:38 PM EST
How about a chance for a good education in a school where the board member's children dont attack teachers?

How about that?

You asked about your hero and I gave you an answer. Better test scores, better schools, far better graduation rates with far fewer dollars.
"What? Me worry? " "whatmeworry.alfred@gmail.com"
[ Parent ]

STFU (none / 0) (#56)
by ObnoxioTheClown on Sat Mar 31, 2007 at 03:40:23 PM EST
There is one hysterical individual here -- you. There's one cheerleader here -- that's you too. You need to put up some real links to real facts or just shut up.

You are wrong and you know it, which is why you rant and rave and change the topic to rail about the Voorheesville schools.

Even when you adjust for poverty rates, Albany still underdelivers. That's why dupes like you are railing constantly about external factors.

Charter schools have not had the dreadful impact on the public schools that you describe -- period.

You show me the drop in per pupil spending attributed by the charter schools. If you can't, I'll assume you conceded the point. Debate over.

[ Parent ]

WTF? (none / 0) (#59)
by champlain on Sun Apr 01, 2007 at 07:06:32 AM EST
I don't know why Albanians aren't up in arms about a bunch of white, male, right-wing ideologues who ride into the Albany school district and theive Albany tax dollars for their charter school get-rich schemes.  But hey, if Albanians want to pay for Tommy Carroll and Bri Backstrom's Clifton Park McMansions - well...only in America.

And I'm not conceeding a single thing to those right-wing clowns who push the view that education is a business and try to use Albanians and other urban districts to make a profit for their shareholders. How cynical can you get? Freaking amazing.

[ Parent ]

Nice diversion (none / 0) (#57)
by ObnoxioTheClown on Sat Mar 31, 2007 at 03:49:34 PM EST
A 5-minute google session the entire process takes a minimum of one year and an average of over 2 years.

Longer durations are common, such as in this case where a teacher who confessed to sending sexual emails to a student -- who took SIX YEARS to fire.

http://www.reason.com/news/show/36802.html

The process to fire a NYS teacher for incompetence or gross misconduct:
http://cgood.org/burdenquestion-6.html

[ Parent ]

Not a diversion (none / 0) (#61)
by champlain on Sun Apr 01, 2007 at 08:27:55 AM EST
The alfreds brought up Voorheesville, not me. Sorry if you don't like the idea that you have to bring written charges and provide a due process hearing if you want to fire a school teacher. But firing a school teacher isn't the same thing as firing the cashier at McDonalds.

School administrators have to be aggressive about pushing a 3201 hearing along if they have a teacher who is incompetent or has engaged in misconduct - that's why school adminstrators get the big bucks, its a complicated job and they need to perform - not screw over the district by embezzling funds.

Again, for the record.  I am not a teacher, I don't belong to any union, I am not an employee or on the payroll of NYSUT or any labor union. I am just a citizen who is deeply disturbed by the charter school tax grab and its implcations for places like Albany.

[ Parent ]

Um CHamp.. (none / 0) (#63)
by alfrednewman on Sun Apr 01, 2007 at 09:16:12 AM EST
You brought up Voorheesville and Eva Joseph.

Forgot to add... (none / 0) (#47)
by champlain (champlain.dia@gmail.com) on Fri Mar 30th, 2007 at 09:19:24 PM EST
champlain
The Voorheesville Superintendent and Assistant Superintendent were referred to the Albany County District Attorney for possible criminal prosecution.
Dr. Eva Joseph isn't looking half bad now, is she?
"What? Me worry? " "whatmeworry.alfred@gmail.com"
[ Parent ]

Actually (none / 0) (#27)
by alfrednewman on Sun Mar 25, 2007 at 06:35:32 PM EST
It was a non binding plebiscite that was just as democratic as the "democratic" elections in the USSR.  

I had another taste of the Albany schools vision of democracy during the last facilities bonding vote- which I voted for- by the way.  The school that I voted at had its front lit up after dark and all the doors were locked.  No notice telling you to go to the back door.  

When you went around to the back all the doors were shut and there were no exterior lights.  It was only because someone left that I was able to see where to go.  They had two rude women in combat cammo demanding photo identification in order to vote!!!!!!  They dont even ask that for presidential elections.

If DIA would give up the ability to post photos I would show you exactly what the Albany City Schools think of democracy.  I took photos of how dark the place was.

Clearly this is an attempt to limit the people who  have to go to the work and who vote during the evenings.  In other words, the Albany home owner.

This spring go look at the signs they put up in front of TOAST.  Look closely at what is covered up.  It says School Vote.  It used to say School BUDGET vote.

Its funny to see you carry on about "Mob Boss" and  the rest when you think that it is democracy to be able to vote on 1/10th of 0ne percent of the schools budget in a district that sets up and then ignores public committees.

Hey Champlain I got to vote on less that $100,000 of a $163,000,000 budget- that is DEMOCRACY???????

I simply cannot understand how you do not consider yourself an apologist and a school district that has to close schools and hide 9th graders  so the state doesn't take over the district anything BUT a failure.

Harriet Gibbons is full of ninth grade students who are not going to be counted.  If they were counted then we would be able to have the district fixed. Because the New York State would be taking o9ver the damn thing.

Maybe you should start looking at the school district a little closer before you try defending their shitty track record and their lies.

"What? Me worry? " "whatmeworry.alfred@gmail.com"
[ Parent ]

Of course its democratic! (none / 0) (#28)
by ObnoxioTheClown on Sun Mar 25, 2007 at 08:12:28 PM EST
Who votes against the children anyway? Either you're pro-child and think puppies are cute, or you don't.

Before I scraped up the cash to send my daughter to holy names, she was having trouble learning math -- not suprising since they teach division with goofy sticks.

My daughter said that she didn't learn because the building was old... I'm so glad the district is addressing that! Now everything's great! The district has spent hundreds of millions of dollars on construction projects, so everything is just peachy!

[ Parent ]

Alfred: (none / 0) (#6)
by alfrednewman on Fri Mar 23, 2007 at 05:50:48 PM EST
Im under the weather tonight.  Finally got the flu.

What was the names of the school board members who moved out of Albany.  One who was president moved just a couple of years ago....

"What? Me worry? " "whatmeworry.alfred@gmail.com"

I don't remember (none / 0) (#7)
by AlfredMoisiu on Fri Mar 23, 2007 at 07:04:49 PM EST
I do know that one or two of the current board members have faculty spouses.

Conflict of interest anyone?

[ Parent ]

Interesting story in todays TU (none / 0) (#8)
by alfrednewman on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 07:42:45 AM EST
ROTTERDAM -- Administrators at the International Charter School of Schenectady have their work cut out for them.

Officials at the Draper Avenue school were notified Friday that SABIS Educational Systems Inc., which the school board recently fired amid disputes over staffing changes and poor test results, will not be sticking around for the rest of the school year...
.
Parents had complained of having to deal with an academic liaison under SABIS, something Martinez said would change. "The board told teachers they are more than welcome to contact parents directly," he said.

So in a Charter School parents can fire the administration when the test scores suck and when they are told that they can't talk to their children's teacher.  Seems to me that this makes the Charter Schools more responsive than a public school where no one gets fired and the test scores still suck. Livingston is going to be closed. Hackett is going to be realligned but lets be honest, no one responsible is going to get axed.
"What? Me worry? " "whatmeworry.alfred@gmail.com"
[ Parent ]

Hard to claim a conflict with a public vote (none / 0) (#11)
by champlain on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 09:19:32 AM EST
Further up the comment string one of the Alfreds tries to make an issue of Albany City School District board members having a spouse that works in the school district.

I don't have the facts on that and I would encourage them to post what they know - that's what this blog is all about. But I would also add that Albany school board members are elected by Albany voters. These are very competitive elections and I suspect that any suspected conflicts of interest were brought out during school board elections. I would also note that there are no public elections for the people who run charter schools and are spending Albany taxpayer dollars.

If the claim of the Alfreds is true, it doesn't seem like the voters in Albany saw a conflict of interest - maybe voters saw it as an advantage rather than a conflict. Who knows?

But again, if the Alfreds know something they should post the facts. Facts are much better than just making allusions and vague accusations.

Champlain (none / 0) (#13)
by alfrednewman on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 10:16:15 AM EST
As an expert in Albany City School District can you tell me if you would consider it a conflict of interest for a school board member to directly vote on a contract or participate in a negotiation that would give their spouces or other relations a raise or benificial work rules?
"What? Me worry? " "whatmeworry.alfred@gmail.com"
[ Parent ]
Not an expert - just a citizen with an opinion (none / 0) (#16)
by champlain on Sun Mar 25, 2007 at 05:51:47 AM EST
I am not an expert on the Albany City School District, far from it. I'm sure to leave any legal opinion on conflicts to the District's lawyer to answer. I'm suspect any board member who may have a spouse who works for the district has obtained a legal opinion. I wasn't aware that the Albany school board actively negotiated collective bargaining agreements - I thought that was left to others and the board simply approved or rejected the proposed agreements. Please post what you know if I am incorrect about this.

My general opinion is that a school board member should always disclose if they have a spouse who works for the district or if they have any financial or other interest in any matter which may come before the board; the board member may also want to recuse themselves from votes that may afford a benefit to their spouse - but again - decisions on that should best be left to the District's lawyer to advise the board member.

You've done a lot of posting about board members and spouses but you haven't said who on the Albany School Board has a spouse who works for the District. Is their one - or is this just rumor and innuendo?

[ Parent ]

No its not a rumor. (none / 0) (#17)
by alfrednewman on Sun Mar 25, 2007 at 08:46:49 AM EST
The school board certainly handles personnel issues and sets the guide lines for union contract negotiations.

The board also signs the contracts and then determines what is "essential" and thus not part of what the tax paying public has the ability to vote on.  During the last budget vote the school district had the gall to tell us they were going to violate New York State cap on contingency budgets (they were going to raise our taxes about twice what the legal cap was) and that all of the Adult Education programs and job training courses were considered "essential" and not subject to the voter.  Nor do we have a vote on athletic spending, after school club spending, band, drivers education, transportation spending, over time spending or anything else that the voters in districts not covered by the small city school's bill.

You are doing the typical splitting of the hairs Champion. Others may fall for it. I will not.

The perception of a conflict is just as important- if not more important- then what a lawyer decides is a legal conflict of interest. Of course an apologist like you want to have the lawyers decide what is an actual conflict on interest.  People should simply vote on the budgets presented to them and accept the candidates that the teachers union puts up and shut up. The parent should give their children over to public school district no choice for you.

Leave the definition of a conflict of interest to an attorney? You have got to be kidding.  Its COMMON SENSE that should dictate what is a conflict and what is right for the citizens.

Champion, you once said you do not live in Albany. Why is it you are so concerned with the expensive failure? Are you a teacher?

"What? Me worry? " "whatmeworry.alfred@gmail.com"
[ Parent ]

That's what happens (none / 0) (#18)
by AlfredMoisiu on Sun Mar 25, 2007 at 09:17:39 AM EST
When the patients run the asylum.

All school district election are non-partisan and held during a regular election cycle, so who do you think votes? Answer: The people who get out the vote... PTA & the teacher and staff unions.

That's why the board has the gall to declare all but a token amount of the budget "essential" and get back to the important business -- a quarter of a billion worth of construction projects and the associated patronage. They have no reason to be responsible because nothing will happen to them.

If the voters aren't going to have a say on eduation spending, then there are two options:

  • Make the elections partisan and make them fit into the normal primary/general election cycle. (This won't help Albany, but there's a whole state out there)

  • Have the state take the schools out of local control, and let professionals decide on the budget with input from county or regional advisory boards.

The system is broken, and too many people have an interest in perpetuating the failure. It's time to cut off the interests.

[ Parent ]
Rumor and innuendo or REAL (none / 0) (#30)
by champlain on Mon Mar 26, 2007 at 06:06:37 PM EST
Again, I have asked WHO ON THE ALBANY CITY SCHOOL BOARD has a spouse who works for the district? Again, you FAIL to say who it is.

People who serve on boards are conflicted out of votes all the time - usually they ask counsel for an opinion on how to go forward and move on to the next agenda item.

From the way you are carrying on it seems like anyone with a conflict has to resign in disgrace from the school board and prepare to be put in the public stocks.  Maybe you'd like them to be stoned in Capital park?

Sheesh, just let us know who it is and quit your crying about it.

[ Parent ]

They are very open (none / 0) (#31)
by ObnoxioTheClown on Mon Mar 26, 2007 at 07:23:06 PM EST
Why don't you follow your own advice and ask them? You expend alot of effort to point out how open they are.

You blow alot of smoke.

First you use an irrelevant incident in Los Angeles to say Albany, NY charter schools are bad.

Then one of the Alfreds points out the extreme total cost of public employees (ie 150% of salary) and you claim its impossible, despite a clear memo from the comptroller's office.

And then you imply that a 20% shift in enrollment to charter schools is insignificant.

The icing in the cake is when you say that it's a-ok for a board member to have a spouse on the faculty. That's nuts.

I'm just a simple clown, but it seems to me that you're too smart to be that dumb. Why don't you disclose your own conflict of interest?

[ Parent ]

Actually (none / 0) (#34)
by alfrednewman on Mon Mar 26, 2007 at 10:20:28 PM EST
I said spouse or other relations. Thanks for trying to narrow the search for me again.

I have looked at who is related to who and where they work in the past.  Very interesting.  

I'm not dumb enough to start naming names.

When you start connecting the dots the whole picture gets really interesting and very ugly.

But wonderfully Albany!  

Ah connections and connections. The more I think the more I realize I am on the wrong side of things here. I simply didn't realize that Albany could be so good for business.

Im beating my head against the wall long enough. Champlain, I called you an apologist. Me bad! Your an opportunist! My kind of guy!

Champ, buddy- pal- I realize that you were really trying to get me on-board and get me to stop rocking the boat.  I have seen the light!

I was going to meet Carroll up in CP (his house is close to my old office- you have the wrong address) and have some drinks with him.  I just sent him an email telling him to stick his charter school up his ass.  I have made the Brighter Choice.  Albany City Schools is my meal ticket from now on!  

 
"What? Me worry? " "whatmeworry.alfred@gmail.com"
[ Parent ]

Champlain (none / 0) (#44)
by alfrednewman on Thu Mar 29, 2007 at 08:38:57 PM EST
The School Board President has relations working in the school district.
"What? Me worry? " "whatmeworry.alfred@gmail.com"
[ Parent ]
Just give me some truth (none / 0) (#45)
by champlain on Fri Mar 30, 2007 at 08:49:07 PM EST
AlfredMoisui makes a claim that two Albany City School District Board members have spouses on the faculty at the District.  But Alfred won't say which Board members. Is Alfred just pushing rumor and innuendo, or are there any facts to his claim?

alfrednewman claims that Albany City School Board Pres. Teneka Frost has relatives who work in the school district.

It may be the case that Ms. Frost has relatives in the district - but alfred pushes an unsupported allegation that implies something 'ugly' or untoward is going on. But where are the facts on this?

I ask, WHERE ARE THE FACTS that Ms. Frost is inappropriately using her position to provide undue benefits to her relatives?

THERE ARE NO FACTS PUT FORWARD TO SUPPORT THIS. Just rumor and innuendo.

Lots of people talk smack on this blog (me included) but if I don't have the facts on something - I SAY I DON'T HAVE THE FACTS.

IF there are facts to support these claims, then the Albany blogosphere is ALL EARS wanting to hear the FACTS.

But if all you have is rumors, then you don't really have much to add, do you?

I am 100% for sharing information on waste and abuse of taxpayer dollars.

I don't care if its Ms. Frost or Mr. Jennings - if this blog is going to have a positive effect on ending the waste and abuse in Albany then people need to share what they know.

People can't stop the waste if it is constantly hidden and can never be dragged into the light.

Give me some truth.

[ Parent ]

Must be really hard (none / 0) (#50)
by alfrednewman on Fri Mar 30, 2007 at 11:55:41 PM EST
carrying so much water for such a failure.  You are doing a good job Champlain.

Really. Hope you get a raise.

Perception, Champlain, the perception of a conflict.

School board sets work rules, handles all of the aspects of employment including promotions and disciplinary actions (and deals with them in executive session) and votes on giving people raises.    

The other school board members have children in the district. There are a lot of benefits to having mommy or daddy on the school board. Better teachers, better education and you can do what ever the fuck you want!

School board member's daughter suspended
Teen is among four students accused in Dec. 23 teacher harassment case at Albany High School

Thursday, January 5, 2006   Page: B1

ALBANY - The daughter of an Albany school board member is among four students who remained suspended Wednesday for allegedly harassing a 60-year-old veteran teacher inside a classroom at Albany High School last month. Laquetta Alexander, who is the 16-year-old daughter of new board member Jacqueline Jen kins-Cox; Debbony Moore, 16; and two unidentified 15-year-old boys are accused of confronting their English teacher, Johnsi Ingram, on Dec. 23.

Capital news 9:
Albany High student sentenced
Updated: 3/27/2006 3:32 PM
By: Capital News 9 Web Staff

An Albany High student has learned her fate for harassing her teacher last year.

An Albany City Court judge sentenced Laquetta Alexander to three years of probation for the classroom taunting of former teacher Johnsi Ingram on Dec. 23. Ingram told police that four students surrounded her as she was in her chair, restrained her and began taunting and touching her in front of the class.

Student Debbony Moore was sentenced Thursday. The names of the two boys charged in the case have not been released due to their ages.

The judge sentenced Alexander on Monday because she didn't complete some of the agreements reached under a plea deal.

Both girls were told to read the landmark Brown vs. Board of Education decision and write an essay on it. They were also supposed to write apology letters to Ingram and their classmates.

Alexander's mother is an Albany School Board member, but she offered no comment at the courthouse.

SO, work for the city, be on the school board and your kid gets to assault a teacher and gets a homework assignment.

By the way, does anyone know if the teacher is still there?  She only had 30 plus years of experience- but who cares, right?  

Homework assignments and the school board member, who raised the little monster, is still "serving" the school district.
"What? Me worry? " "whatmeworry.alfred@gmail.com"
[ Parent ]

And by the way (none / 0) (#51)
by alfrednewman on Sat Mar 31, 2007 at 12:01:53 AM EST
the daughter of the school board member didnt even do the damned homework.

Great inspiration to all Albany City School students.  Assault and torment a teacher, get homework and dont even bother doing that.

I did a google search. No information about Tommy Carroll's kid assaulting a charter school teacher.  

No news stories about the kid not doing his homework either.
"What? Me worry? " "whatmeworry.alfred@gmail.com"
[ Parent ]

Ms. Jenkins-Cox (none / 0) (#52)
by champlain on Sat Mar 31, 2007 at 06:13:49 AM EST
You may remember that the Mayor inserted himself into the school board elections in 2005. School board elections are supposed to be non-partisan but the Mayor stepped way over that line and made very large contributions to a slate of three candidates. Only one of the Mayor's three sponsored candidates won...Ms. Jenkins-Cox.

Ms. Jenkins-Cox and Jerry Jennings have a lot in common, both refused to debate their opponents during the 2005 election. Not exactly 'democracy in albany'.

Again I'll quote Dr. Alice Green discussing Hizzoner:

"He simply dismisses those with opposing views. The mayor not only squashes dissent, he does not even tolerate debate."

Ms. Jenkins-Cox's term ends this year. If she runs again, I don't believe she will be re-elected to the Albany School Board.

[ Parent ]

Ans will repeat (none / 0) (#55)
by alfrednewman on Sat Mar 31, 2007 at 02:50:15 PM EST
that the daughter of a school board member can terrorize and assullt her teahcer and get a HOMEWORK assignement as punishment.

Nice to know that family can act as they wish.

So Champlain, next time you are on break why dont you see if the daughter was allowed back into school.
"What? Me worry? " "whatmeworry.alfred@gmail.com"
[ Parent ]

Ah I see (none / 0) (#58)
by ObnoxioTheClown on Sat Mar 31, 2007 at 04:00:18 PM EST
The friend of my enemy is my enemy?

And since you have no discernable affiliation with the school district, WTF do you know about someone's election prospects?

If you're a well-funded candidate with a solid base, you generally avoid debates like the plague -- there's nothing for you to do but fuck up. Particularly in a dinky school board election, where nobody is actually watching it, unless you say something silly.

If you were intellectually honest, you'd recognize that the mayor you despise in his own way a product of your beloved school district. I'm sure that right now the hundreds of millions of dollars being blown on construction and consultants will benefit the career of some other hack working there now.

[ Parent ]

Ms. Jenkins-Cox is not a good board member (none / 0) (#60)
by champlain on Sun Apr 01, 2007 at 07:47:27 AM EST
For posters who claim to know a lot about local politics and the interconnectedness of Albany you conveniently ignore that Ms. Jenkins-Cox's campaign was funded by Jerry Jennings to the tune of several thousands of dollars. Jerry stepped over a line that had not yet been crossed before when he brought partisanship and big dollars into the school board elections. Jerry's grasping for control is non-stop.

Other than Ms. Jenkins-Cox, Jennings has only very weak influence on the Albany City School Board. Since the Jer always tries to play mob boss and control everything in his orbit this lack of control pisses him off to no end. Jerry's failure to totally control the school board is one of the reasons why Jerry's quotes supporting the Brighter Choice charter school show up on the Brighter Choice web site. Jerry's quote was delivered the same year that he broke with his party and endorsed George Pataki for Governor. Jer was busy providing local political cover for Albany's invasion of the Charter Schools. What did Albany get as the quid pro quo - MUCH FATTER CITY PILOT PAYMENTS FROM THE STATE - courtesy of King George Pataki. Under Jerry's quid pro quo scheme these pilot payments will support Jer's covention center scheme. It is written right into the state law. It's not hard to figure out the interconnections.

This just goes further to prove my point that Jerry and his allies are a bunch of thugs looking to grab whatever they can get and are always looking for the payoff. In this case Jer got a multi-million dollar payoff for a convention center scheme that Albany doesn't need or want. Ms. Jenkins-Cox is just one little cog in that big fat machine of graft and corruption. She won't be re-elected.

Anybody who runs for a publicly elected position but won't debate? That's just un-American. I could agree with a candidate's positions 100% - but if they won't debate - they lose my vote.

P.S. I was waiting for some one to use the "T" word (terrorizes). The prize goes to alfrednewman!

Toodles.  Say 'hi' to Tommy and Bri for me.

[ Parent ]

What's important (none / 0) (#38)
by champlain on Wed Mar 28, 2007 at 12:09:54 AM EST
I may have been a bit strident in this diary - but the topic of providing a free and equal and QUALITY education to kids who live in poor districts is important.  

A free and democratic education worked wonders in pulling me out of an underachieving swampland and pushed me out into the world to achieve many things I never thought I could do.  I can only wish that the kids in Albany, Cohoes, Watervliet, Lansingburgh, Troy and Rensselaer are getting some of the same kind of atmosphere that swirled around my public school.

I would urge readers to step outside of yourself for a moment. Stop looking at this issue as a parent or a 'consumer' of education and take a kid's perspective.  A kid doesn't care if she goes to a charter school or a regular public school.  

What she cares about is:

Am I going to be safe?
Will I have friends?
Will I like my teachers and will they like me?
Will my teachers care about me?
Will it be fun?
Will we learn things that are interesting to me?
What if I fail - what will happen to me - will the teachers help me if I am in trouble?

I don't think the charter school movement as it was conceived in the mid 1990's was a bad idea, but that original idea included local initiation and local control with lots of community involvement.

That was the ideal -  but the Brighter Choice types have twisted that into a strange attack with glossy propaganda and op-ed screeds bashing local school board members and local educators. The original idea didn't include a charter school board full of right-wing ideologues from far flung cities who had no experience nor any scholarship in education for low-income urban communities. The original idea didn't include a charter school board with few or no ties to the communities they served. Somewhere along the way the charter school movement got hijacked from being community action aimed at improving schools to some bizarro-world fantasy of making money off education and assigning blame through advertising campaigns, lobbying and op-ed rants.

The divide and conquer attitudes and tactics of the Brighter Choice types have soured me right from the very beginning.  The Brighter Choice hubris and high-volume attacks have poisoned what should be a civil discourse on how Albany can provide a quality education to its children and keep the District's costs under some reasonable control.

But Albanians don't often have that civil discourse. What Albany has is a Mayor and his Police Chief taking shots at the District to take the focus off City government failures; the Brighter Choice types taking shots at the District; various community factions taking shots at the District; private school types taking shots at the District; Board members of the District take shots at each other.

Actually, the ACSD board members usually keep the sniping at each other under reasonable control, but I can see how an ACSD board member would feel like they are constantly under attack from all quarters. It is a thankless job but it is also an incredibly important job. As the charter schools flood into Albany it becomes a critical job if the district is going to be able to survive.

People who are alot smarter than I am make reasonable arguments that public schools easily compete with private when factors like poverty, special education and english speaking ability are taken into consideration:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/gerald-bracey/public-schools-are-overac_b_44370.html

Albany City School District has a long list of difficult problems: a long history of party patrongage and nepotisim; a long term and intense competition from Catholic and other private schools; a thinly veiled contempt that causes some in Albany to always portray the District as a 'mess' or a 'failure'.

Nevertheless, I continue to be optimistic about the Albany City School District. I am impressed by people like Teneka Frost and believe the District will survive the Brighter Choice types and be much stronger in the future.


Perspective of a Child (none / 0) (#41)
by alfrednewman on Wed Mar 28, 2007 at 12:33:52 PM EST
Wow, agreeing with Champlian in really proving to be more a challange than I thought.  
Champion posted the following crap:
A kid doesn't care if she goes to a charter school or a regular public school.  

What she cares about is:
Am I going to be safe?
Will I have friends?
Will I like my teachers and will they like me?
Will my teachers care about me?
Will it be fun?
Will we learn things that are interesting to me?
What if I fail - what will happen to me - will the teachers help me if I am in trouble?

If this isnt a really good example of whats is wrong with America. Be the damned adult in the relationship. Make the choices for child. A child doesnt know what is best for them. You et your kid pick its food as well?

Anyone who says that they can learn from a child is an idiot.  

Nothing you wrote says one thing about that childs future. The only thing that should be of concern and that is relevant is the following:

Will my child learn?

Good GOD.
 
"What? Me worry? " "whatmeworry.alfred@gmail.com"
[ Parent ]

Leave Albania alone (none / 0) (#42)
by AlfredMoisiu on Wed Mar 28, 2007 at 06:49:38 PM EST
But Albanians don't often have that civil discourse.

As an official representative of the people of Albania, I ask you to leave us the fuck out of it. We've been through enough and don't want to be mixed up in your provincial American politics.

Besides, even though we're a tiny and relatively isolated post-marxist state, we have a higher literacy rate than your students.



[ Parent ]
So that's why you're against charter schools. (none / 0) (#43)
by ObnoxioTheClown on Wed Mar 28, 2007 at 07:11:03 PM EST
"Albany City School District has a long list of difficult problems: a long history of party patrongage and nepotisim; a long term and intense competition from Catholic and other private schools; a thinly veiled contempt that causes some in Albany to always portray the District as a 'mess' or a 'failure'."

Party patronage and nepotism are common in almost all school districts, because until a couple of years ago, nobody was looking at it. Remember the Long Island school district "missing" a few million? I'm sure that none of these multi-million dollar, bottomless pit school construction projects are dirty...

Competition from Catholic and Private schools isn't a problem, it's called reality. 50 years ago Albany Schools sucked, but were cheap. Today they are pricing the private schools out of the market, since we all get to pay for them. But they still suck.

The contempt is there because the place is a disgrace.

China and India is turning the sons and daughters of illiterate peasants who live in shanties into skilled Engineers -- over 1.2 million a year. Those children live in abject poverty, use textbooks are written in a foreign language (English) -- yet still they succeed. And we can barely teach kids to read in their native tounge.

Something is badly wrong, and apologists like you are part of the problem.

[ Parent ]

Your claims (none / 0) (#62)
by champlain on Sun Apr 01, 2007 at 08:58:34 AM EST
You claim that the Albany City School District is a disgrace and 'something is badly wrong'.

I claim that poverty and past decades of using the district as a patronage mill makes it a complicated situation - but there are reasons to be optimistic and get behind the District.

You claim the charter school swells are the solution.

I claim the charter school tax grab is a scheme to divide the limited tax resources of a struggling urban district and rob the Albany taxpayers by setting up yet another 'separate' school system in Albany (besides the public school system and the private school system).

I see the District as having dozens of public meetings, competitive board elections, budget forums, budget votes, lots of public involvement and a website that has loads of info from A to Z.

If Albanians WANT to be involved they have loads of opportunities.

You're posting alot...but you're not saying anything.

What EXACTLY is the 'disgrace' that you talk about. You say 'something is badly wrong'.

High poverty urban districts always struggle with test scores and drop out rates. Albany is no different.

WHAT EXACTLY is wrong with the district? I have suggested several problems - things that can be worked on and remedied. WHAT EXACTLY is wrong with the district?

What is your view?

[ Parent ]

What is wrong? (none / 0) (#64)
by firefoxfan on Mon Apr 02, 2007 at 05:47:09 AM EST
As someone who has been a student in the district more recently than probably all of you (say, the past decade), I can tell you what was wrong back then...and probably worse now.

If you are not in an AP course or otherwise advanced, you can kiss it goodbye at Albany High. Most of the time is spent in the regents classes and non-honors/AP disciplining students. Yes my fellow progressive ostriches, D-I-S-C-I-P-L-I-N-I-N-G.

Its that simple-when you are in a non-advanced class, its one step above a demilitarized zone.
Lunch and gym class are like prison--white kids sit with white kids, black kids with black, with little exception. The only consistent vehicle for integration is athletics--the sports teams. Other than that, there are three Albany High Schools-the advanced classes, the average classes, and the hallway where these two intersect. Patrolling these halls are hall monitors-some fair, some not. Some will tell you to take your jacket off (per the school dress code) if you are of the opposite race, while letting those who look more like them walk by with their jackets on.  This is all anecdotal of course, but I wasn't the only one who noticed it.
SO--if you go to AHS, try and get advanced and play sports, otherwise its going to be a major uphill climb in your (hopefully) 4 years of high school.

New buildings and new acoustics at Giffen are not going to change this. Alas, the only thing that will (because the problems begin at home and at a young age), is an institution that will inspire as much fear and command as much respect as the student body inspires and demands from the teachers. It sounds old-fashioned or worse, but nothing else will get people into line by the time they reach high school when, since elementary school, right up through middle school at those twin pillars of achievement (Hackett and Livingston; I can't speak to the latest school), these students have been allowed absolute license in their actions.

[ Parent ]

Charter School Stoopid | 64 comments (64 topical, 0 hidden)
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