Class War Update


By DIA, Section News
Posted on Tue Jan 30, 2007 at 04:17:29 AM EST

The US Chamber of Commerce is outraged!! They are very against the idea of raising the minimum wage. Especially because of the harsh implications for large corporations in the Senante bill. While workers would get a raise, small businesses would get some tax breaks to accomodate for the higher wages they'd have to pay...big businesses are getting hit with harsh penalties.
To help pay for the cost of those tax breaks, corporations no longer would be able to deduct the cost of jury verdicts or settlements in liability suits against them and their executives' tax-deferred pay packages would be capped at $1 million a year
Capping tax deferred pay packages at $1 million a year?! Has it come to this? Its this country truly insane?? How do you expect CEO's to get by if they can't put more than a $1 million in their retirement fund every year. Do you realize they only made $10,982,000 (on average) in 2006? Its a good thing they have the Chamber of Commerce to fight for their rights.

Its also a good thing that workers have Democrats to fight for theirs.

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Class War Update | 11 comments (11 topical, 0 hidden)
Class War... (none / 0) (#1)
by hawkny on Tue Jan 30, 2007 at 04:23:26 AM EST
Where are unions when we need them?

supporting Joe Bruno (none / 0) (#2)
by DIA on Tue Jan 30, 2007 at 04:30:25 AM EST
as far as i can tell.  

[ Parent ]
what unions? (none / 0) (#3)
by alfrednewman on Tue Jan 30, 2007 at 07:49:33 AM EST
Lets see:

Where are the unions....

In the ash bin of American history along with the industries that they helped to destroy?

When is the last time you saw a new Checker Cab?
"What? Me worry? " "whatmeworry.alfred@gmail.com"
[ Parent ]

Class War Update (none / 0) (#4)
by hawkny on Tue Jan 30, 2007 at 12:09:28 PM EST
Hmmmmm. If the unions are gone, and the government is pro corporation, the only way to describe the working guy/gal is......."screwed"!!!

actually (none / 0) (#5)
by alfrednewman on Tue Jan 30, 2007 at 12:36:14 PM EST
the only place that is being unionized is the government. So we are all, in fact screwed.
"What? Me worry? " "whatmeworry.alfred@gmail.com"
[ Parent ]
Class War (none / 0) (#6)
by A Muse on Tue Jan 30, 2007 at 02:26:00 PM EST
Yes it is a class war in every sense, as the divide grows between rich and poor.  Our definitions of rich and poor have also changed.  A poor man in this country would be a rich man elsewhere.  The unions in some sense have put themselves out of business.  The strong-arm tactics that were so successful years ago are not looked upon so kindly today.  My wife's father was a union organizer in the garment district of NYC at the turn of the century.  He also rode shotgun (literally) for some well-known businessmen in the "wine" business.  The power today is in the hands of the voting shareholders of public corporations voting to cap packages that are a bad joke.  Unions need reorganization to be a success today, however, it may not help.
Well, there you go again, Al. (none / 0) (#7)
by Jim Travers on Tue Jan 30, 2007 at 02:33:02 PM EST
Unions are "In the ash bin of American history along with the industries that they helped to destroy?"

Please stand behind your words and demonstrate the truthfulness of your statement.

What industries have been destroyed by any union, ever? And remember, you're being asked this by a retired union iron worker, who knows greed and greed alone, cost his brothers their jobs.

I do know of a few unions that have been badly damaged or destroyed by industrialists, though.

While it may be true that unions are "in the ash bin...", it is assuredly not from their own doing.

It seems to me that you've bought into the right wing/corporate rhetoric, that 'the unions are killing us', lock, stock and barrel.

Walmart is a success, in your book, regardless of the cost to small nearby businesses, because they're non-union?

Show me any year that Ford or any other of the big three, lost money due to the unions, even over the past few years of record losses. The unions haven't caused their demise. Their management had decided upon their unsaleable product line, not the unions.

Obviously, they weren't communicating well with Cheney or the oil companies, who I believe are, in no small way, responsible, along with their own short-sighted management, for their recent losses.

Seems to me that it was the labor provided by unions that enabled them to become the mega-rich corporations and individuals they have.

The unionized oil companies are crumbling?? In the ash bin?

Unionized GE is dying? Losing money?

Also, please answer this: Why were unions necessary, to begin with?

Jim (none / 0) (#8)
by alfrednewman on Tue Jan 30, 2007 at 09:58:10 PM EST
Jim I have a lot of respect for you and your opinions. I have toned down my usual confrontational posts lately because I respect  you. As I have said to you privately and I will say publically, you have made me review and reevaluate my beliefs.  

Deep down I am convinced that we are not as different in our politics and outlook as you think.  Maybe we should look to see what common ground we both have and build on that instead of trying to out do each other with nasty and confrontational remarks.

I spent the better part of the last hour composing a rebuttle to your post and I am simply not going to post it.

Can I answer all of your questions? Absolutly. My Pop was an honorable man who was a union local president. During my graduate studies I did an extensive research project on labor relations that frankly surprised me.

I hate Walmart with an almost religious passion. GE is mostly NON UNION and unions were necessary to begin with, because of unsafe working conditions and extremely poor pay.

But seriously Jim, lets try to find common ground. Lets see if we can find agreement. Lets see if we can learn from each other.  You have experiences that I will never be able to experience. I have bungled my way into experiences that you will bever experience.

Is it too much of a reach to expect that we can learn from each other? I am certainly willing to listen and think- are you?
"What? Me worry? " "whatmeworry.alfred@gmail.com"
[ Parent ]

OK, Al! (none / 0) (#9)
by Jim Travers on Tue Jan 30, 2007 at 11:18:50 PM EST
I have learned much from you already and will continue to learn more from and about you as time goes by.

And Al, barring events of the recent past, I'm one of the happiest guys I know, and have a rather positive personal outlook. Just ask anyone who knows me.

I'm not an angry guy, but some things your city is trying to do to my town does indeed anger me.

As do many of the social injustices visited upon those in our society who think they are powerless and believe they are because they are told that they are. They are without voice because they have not yet become empowered, enabling them to shout out and demand change.

Peace and blessings.

And you know I'm no Hippie!

Hippy generation (none / 0) (#10)
by alfrednewman on Wed Jan 31, 2007 at 06:15:43 AM EST
Jim:

You have actually hit upon the reason why I hold the philosophy that I do.  There are indeed people who believe that they are powerless and that they will be failures if they take a risk because they are told that they will fail.  I was told  I couldn't do what I have been able to on several occasions. I was told that my current job was going to be a monumental mistake. I am told now that my next venture (already in the works) is surely going to fail.  Sometimes I fail. Sometimes I succeed. But I always try.

People like to take issue with my stubborn and traditional beliefs. Sometimes to the point where they predict my early demise, write my obituary and disclose my well known mental proclivities. I simply laugh and go on.        

You are wrong that people need to be empowered to shout out and demand change. People should be encouraged to go out and *work* for the changes they want.  When you demand change you generally are demanding it from the same group of people who have been an institutional resistence to it. This goes to the very core of our Republic. We should allow ourselves where others grant our rights. We already have those rights unless we allow them to be taken from us.

I don't demand change. If there is something that I feel strongly about or if there is a wrong inflicted upon me I will take action- not make demands that someone else take action..
"What? Me worry? " "whatmeworry.alfred@gmail.com"
[ Parent ]

editing error (none / 0) (#11)
by alfrednewman on Wed Jan 31, 2007 at 06:22:52 AM EST
The line should have been "we should NOT allow ourselves to be in a position where others grant us our rights."

Had someone standing at my desk distracting me while typing.    
"What? Me worry? " "whatmeworry.alfred@gmail.com"
[ Parent ]

Class War Update | 11 comments (11 topical, 0 hidden)
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